The answer to yesterday’s question, what do a fish, a ball, and a cold have in common? They all can be caught. Today’s question is what do the following movies have in common: The Odd Couple, Dad, Some Like it Hot, Movies is not the answer.
Been a busy weekend. I’ve been really doing a lot of yard work. Spent four or five hours outside yesterday. Pulling a lot of weeds. Damn I should have never let it get that much out of hand. However, when you are working four jobs (care giving, my own business, two CPA firm jobs) there just isn’t enough time in the day to the things you really need to do. You go to work when it is dark and come home when it is dark. You don’t even see your yard let alone see what needs to be done. Some of the weeds out there would be good additions to the Redwood National Forrest. Some of the weeds pull easy, some require the winner of the World’s Strongest Man contest to pull. I’m half done. It won’t be done today though. I have a business lunch meeting. Then there is the first of two nights at Mom’s.
Speaking of Mom I need some advise here. My sister wants Mom to come to Utah for three weeks in July. I really love sis. I know as long as sis is alive I will never be either alone or homeless. I also know how hard it is for them to pack up every two months and come up to give me a break. It is really above and beyond the call of duty. Certainly a lot more than what my clueless brother does. Having mom go to Utah for three weeks would make it easier for them and give me a break. A break where I would be free to travel. Go doown to the LA area to explore winter homes, maybe connect with Russ, maybe have lunch with Pat. However, I am not sure three weeks in Utah would really be the best for Mom or Sis. Sis and I care for mom in different ways. Who is to say which way is better, sis or mine? We just care for Mom differently. I let Mom make all her own decisions. I trust her to take all her medication (I do monitor it but do it so mom doesn’t know I’m monitoring). Since Mom and my politics are in line with each other, whatever discussions we have are friendly discussions. When Mom turns up the TV because she can’t hear the program I just bite the bullet and watch along with her even though it does hurt my ears. I let Mom make most of her decisions and the other ones that I make for Mom I let Mom tell me what she wants before I make them. With sis, the politics of her husband and her and Mom’s are extremely different. That leads to arguments. Mom has had four heart attacks and four strokes. Arguments aren’t the best for her. Mom told me during the last visit that after one of the arguments she for the first time in a while took a nitro under the tongue. Sis has high blood pressure. The arguments aren’t good for her either. My solution would be just not to talk politics but that isn’t what will ever happen. Fox news will be on all the time. They will criticize every Democrat in the free world and basically blast everything Mom believes in. The only saving grace is that they will have the TV so low that Mom can’t hear it. So Mom will go into her bedroom to watch TV. In addition every decision is made for Mom, she really isn’t allowed to have any say in things like when and what medicine to take or what and when to eat. If they decide Mom doesn’t need something, they throw it out without asking her if she still wants it. It really is kind of demeaning for Mom. The good thing is that mom loves the same books as sis, she loves having someone around all the time. They do have many good moments.
Here is my dilemma. I honestly think Mom going to Utah would be very unhealthy for both Mom and sister. In mom’s case with all her health issues it may even be deadly. I’m not overstating that. In sister’s case it could really be bad for her blood pressure and emotional well being because truthfully Mom a lot of times isn’t really easy to be around. Mom will at times say mean things that cut to the core. Things that are hard to recover from. It could be really hard for sister to recover from three weeks with Mom. So what do I do? Be very selfish and strongly promote Mom going away for three weeks? Or discourage the trip because I think it would be unhealthy for everyone involved but me. Thanks for your help.
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30 comments:
I've never heard of a movie called "Dad", so I'd have to look it up to answer.
I read your blog quickly today, but off hand, I'd say I think your mom should go stay with your sister for an extended period - if she's physcially able to make such a trip. Even if there are some "rough patches", they'll both learn what works and what doesn't. And, one of the toughest things for ANY of us to remember is that there are many ways to accomplish a given task. And while YOUR way may be the best for YOU, it doesn't mean that MY way isn't best for ME. And if both styles wind up with the same result, there's no harm. IMHO. 8^)
Hi Mary Z
Dad was actually a pretty decent movie.
As to the other thanks for the input. Part of what I see is that both ways don't end up in the same result, one ends up with two people less healthy, the other only ends up with me less healthy.
Bill
oh oh...I think I know!!
Hi Dona
You did know!
Bill
Bill I think you should let your mom go...but I guess let her make the decision...if she wants to go...by all means let her go and give you a break. I totally understand what all you are saying and I do agree with you, (I am living it too) but I also know how much I would love a break and with such a wonderful sis to even take the time, I think this is something you should bite your tongue on and let it happen.
Will you have to in a way start over when she gets back? Probably, but with a break it might not seem like such a daunting task.
And, your sister may want to have some quality time with her mother too. This may be the only way she can do it and who are you to say no?
By gosh I say let her go! Or tell her there is a 82 year old man in Indiana who she can have for the 3 weeks! I'll take the break...heck I will even come pull your weeds! :)
Yay!!! :)
Hi
Heck if you did the weekds I'd even pay for you and the Shankster to come out here!
I truthfully think if the decision was left up to mom she wouldn't go. She would use excuses like her doctors are here etc.
I had never considered, however, about sis maybe wanting quality time to spend with Mom. That may be the best way for me to approach it.
And yes, I will have to start over when she comes back.
I think you have almost convinced me to encourage mom to go!
Bill
Almost?
Just do it....if nothing else, you did something nice for your sister by letting her spend time with mom, that should make you smile.
Bill, I understand your concerns. Not to speak out of school, but DR has some of the same concerns at the moment, I believe. Not the political thing, but losing control (DR, tell me if I'm off base and I'll apologize).
I think in your place, I'd leave it to mom to decide. Selfish? Maybe. But I like the idea of letting the oldsters (us oldsters?) make their own decisions as long as they are capable of doing so. You might point out the hazards to both mom and sis, and encourage them to keep their political ideas to themselves as nobody ever changes because of an argument. Beyond that, it's up to both of them, IMO.
Would your sis like to take my mom for a month or two? {g}
PS: I think I got the question right.
Hi Dona
Yup almost, the problem I am having is that if I leave the decision up to mom she won't go. So then I have to really push her to go which means if she goes down to Utah and there is a big fight and mom dies of a heart attack I'll feel guilty the rest of my life!
Bill
Hi Pat
You did get the question right.
Yes, DR has some of the same concerns but in her case I think it is a move and not a temporary trip.
The problem I have with leaving it up to Mom is I know she will decide not to go. So that puts me in the position of saying OK mom don't go or try to change her mind to do something she might not really want to do because it would make my life easier. That is where the struggle comes in.
The other problem is nobody can tell sis that she shouldn't talk about politics because that would cause a very tense argument right there. I've tried before and all it does is get me in a tither.
My sis would take both Dona's dad and your mom!
Bill
Oh, BIll, how I empathize with your decision, given my current situation. No, Pat, you didn't speak out of turn at all. For months, there was consideration of Mom going to AZ, most of which started with the combination of failing eyesight, lack of mobility, time in a power wheel chair and questions of whether - or for how long - she could live alone.
The decision was made, while she was in AZ for an extended period, for her to move out there and live with Deb. I ran a "Ben Franklin" sheet. While you're talking temporary and I'm talking probably permanent, the equestions and issues remain and I suspect many of mine are similar to yours.
I've been doing this daily/hourly for five years, with some major traumas. Deb has had Mom to visit for three weeks each winter, but has never been back here through the surgeries, rehabs, major traumas, although she's made three trips here since January and had Mom for three months. I don't think she knows what she's getting into, particularly with the recent allergy issues. Deb doesn't trust doctors. At all. I tend to listen to doctors, do web research, talk to Mom about all the info and work with her to make a decisions. Deb doesn't. I take notes and ask questions (what's the vision level, how severe is the allergic reacton, what are the three most important things we need to do?) Deb doesn't take notes and doesn't ask questions, so we don't know, for example, what the vision fluctation was in AZ.
As Mary Z said, there are different ways of taking care of our elders and it's hard to let someone else do it differently. As Pat pointed out, for me, some of it is control issues. I know what I've done and what's worked and what hasn't. I have five years experience dealing with the issues and Deb is starting from scratch (because God forbid she take any advice or suggestions from me). If Mom says something is "silly" I ignore it and do what needs to be done. If she says that to Deb, Deb agrees they don't need to do it. Different approaches. And since neither of them likes making decisions, life just kind of goes wherever. Maybe that's the way it needs to be.
Mom made the decision, based on I'm not sure what criteria. Deb is already playing the martyr (whatever Mom wants or needs) and that raises some red flags. OTOH, I've had the blessing of taking care of Mom through some pretty rough times and, as Dona said, maybe Sis needs some quality time with your mom. I think that's partly where Deb's coming from, plus she needs a "cause, at this point. I won't fight them both. As Himself keeps telling me, "Your job is to pick up the pieces."
Quite frankly, I have some concerns about the permanent move to AZ and what it may mean for Mom and Deb, but there's nothing I can do about it at the moment, except accept it and hope it works well. In your case, you're looking at a temporary situation which will give you a break (or not, as I learned when Mom was in AZ for three months), but it WILL give your sister an opportunity to see just what your mom needs and give your mom an opportunity to see what life is like with someone else as a caregiver and that may end up being a good thing for all of you.
Obviously, I have no answers. IF you think no harm will come to your mom as a result of the visit, I'd say have her go and let the chips fall where they may, so long as you have close contact if needed. It may serve to open the eyes of several people and it will give you a break you've needed for some time if you're not constantly on phone alert and such.
Who knows? We may both discover unsuspected strengths in both our moms and sisters. Fortuntely, we don't have the political issues to deal with in my case, but there are lots of other issues that are going to come to the fore, I suspect. I can only tell myself it will be an interesting experience and, worst case, we can move Mom back here and figure out the best of logistics. It may do all of you some good for Mom to go to Utah and experience her options and the differences.
Prayers and good vibes during the decision process, Bill.
Hi DR
What is a Ben Franklin sheet?
I'm not sure either Mom or Sis know what they are getting into.
Not trusting doctors would be a huge issue for you mom in Arizona, and it would probably make even more work for you sister who probably doesn't see that right now.
When I was caring for dad, sis wouldn't even think of asking how to do it, instead they would tell me what to do. Deb kind of sounds like the same way.
If mom went to Utah I, truthfully, would not say in close contact with her. It would be a break all the way.
Thanks for the prayers. They are very much needed.
Bill
Just adding a comment so there aren't 13 comments.
Bill
First off Bill, I am sending the good vibes and prayers your way also during this decision time. Its all so very hard isn't it? Seems like it would be a very easy decision...you need a break and fortunately there is a sibling who is offering. What a deal!
But then as we all know all too well being in this for a while now, its not as easy as it looks or sounds. So then we worry. So I am sure praying you will make the right decision for you.
I do have one question for all here. It was something Ladydr said...As Himself keeps telling me, "Your job is to pick up the pieces."
Is anyone else besides me getting tired of picking up the pieces! Wow, I know why I come here...we are all in the same boat!
Bill, in reading your later comments, that your mom would not go if it were left to her, that puts kind of a different light on things. But I guess I'll stick to my original reaction and say she should be the one to decide. If there's convincing to be done, let your sis do it, and then you won't have cause to feel guilty if it doesn't turn out well.
Dona, to answer your question: ME! ME! I'm totally tired of picking up the pieces, just as you and a lot of others here are.
Bill.... I don't envy your decision. But I concur with everyone here. I would emphaise that it gives her and sis a chance to spend time together, just the two of them. It's time for girl time.
It will be some work up front, packing her meds, suitcase and such. But, then you have those 3 weeks to do what BILL want's and should have a chance to do. And if anything should happen while your Mom is with sis (God forbid) ... you cannot blame yourself. Blame will do no good what-so-ever. Somethings you just can't and shouldn't control.
Sending Hugs & extra strength,
K
Hi Dona
Yes we are in the same boat!
It should be an easy decision. Mom just packs up and goes. I let go. And everyone is happy. Then there is reality.
The key in your response is "making the right decision for me" I've been to much of a martyr for to long of a time. Time to say get the hell out of here and me have my three weeks!
I sure in the hell am tired of picking up the pieces! I've been doing since 2001 when dad got sick. And a lot of piece picking up came after bouts between mom and sis!
Bill
Hi Pat
Great advise about letting my sister do the convincing.
Another tired of picking up the pieces!
Bill
Hi Kaye
Hope both you and your car are surviving!
But I want to control everything!
Thanks for the hugs!
Bill
I agree with everyone here. I say let your mother decide or step out of the way so your sister and mom can spend time together-something your sister may regret later is that she didn't spend time with mom. Besides many of your posts say you never have the time to do all you want including in this post you mention that. Who are you to decide whether to deprive a mother and daughter some time together. Give up the control already and give up "perfect".I didn't see the movie Dad so I can't complete an answer.
A ben franlin sheet or as we say in my business a ben franklin close is where you get a sheet of paper, draw a line down the middle and one side list the pros and the other side the cons and see which side is the winner with more reasons listed to come to a decision. Forgot to say this on my last post.
Hi Red
Thanks for telling me what a Ben Franklin sheet is.
See I really think everyone is missing that if Mom decides for herself she wouldn't go to sis's. She would decide to stay here. That is where my problem comes, is whether or not to push her to go. Like she said yesterday if she was to go down there the only reason she would be going is to give me break. I want her to go because she wants to go not because she wanted to spend time with sis.
Bill
Sounds like you don't need any advice from anyone and that you might have already made your mind up. However, I still feel you're one of three children and your mom should decide, good or bad and whether you agree or not, if she wants to spend time with one of her other children is all. Should be her decision is how I would feel if I were the mom.
Hi
I'm not the one that has made up her mind, mom has.
Here is what is confusing me.
Everyone is saying.
1. Back off give up the control.
2. Let your sis and mom work it out.
3. It would be good for sis and mom to spend time togehter.
4. Let your mom make up her own mind.
Here is what I can't seem to get across:
If mom made her own mind she wouldn't to go to Utah.
The only way she would go to Utah is for me to make the decision for her to go. Isn't that exactly what everyone is telling me not to do?
And if I push her into going with it being my decision and not hers and it turns out to badly am I not responsible for the harm?
Bill
I guess the whole point is you shouldn't "push" her to do anything and butt out of the whole situation. If your mom decides not to go so be it then it is totally her decision and you didn't "push" or have to feel guilty about anything.Instead be supportive of whatever she decides I think is what everyone is saying. It is not your decision top make. If she decides not to go then that's her decision and just let it be. She's certainly capable of making up her own mind whatever the decision is!
I can't believe you're not familiar with the Ben Franklin Sheet (g). Draw a line down the middle of the paper. Write the issue at the top. One column is pros, one is cons. Try to be objective. When you know you're being subjective, put an "S" in front of the item. I think I was about 16, when Daddy introduced me to the concept and process and it's stood me in good stead for 46 years, when I remember to use it, rather than just worry and ponder and stew.
It's Deb that doesn't trust doctors. Mom simply doesn't know how to deal with them and has a tendency to either buy what they say with no questions or ignore what they way, without asking what the ramifications of doing so may be.
Again, although I'm certainly not there and privy to all the issues, it may be a Good Thing for Mom and Sis to have a few weeks to deal with each other, without you there to bail them out every day. Sis may discover just what's involved and Mom may discover all that you do and that sometimes she can be, perhaps, a bit unreasonable in her expectaions. Unless you truly feel there is some health hazard in her visit, the break from you could be beneficial for all three of you.
Donna, Bill, Pat and others - I think we're all tired of picking up the pieces. I'm not sure how that filtered into my job description, but Himself contends I've been doing it since he first met me, whether for my sibs or, over the past five-plus years, for Mom.
Bill, I'm glad to see you say this will be a complete break and you're going to do for You while Mom is gone. You've been picking up pieces for eight years. You're not a martyr, nor do you act like one (although I sure know it sometimes feels that way and it's really hard not to, when it seems one is giving up one's own life!)
Okay, I see what you're saying about the decision process. Mom pretty much doesn't want to make a decision, she wants someone else to make it for her. While I don't know this for a fact, I suspect the decision to move to AZ was largely impacted by Deb's input during her time out there. Add to that the fact that Mom moving out there and helping with expenses will ease the burden on Deb. Add the fact that Mom and I did talk about how long she could live alone, caretakers and assisted living. Does Mom really want to go? I have some doubts, based on her comments about missing all the "green" and the mountains and telling her internist that she hated the thought of having to find new doctors she could talk with and trust. But, the decision is made, regardless of why or by what input. I honestly think "Mom's decision" was made by Deb and what she thinks Deb needs. Is Sis wanting Mom to visit enough to encourage the trip? Your mom is pretty safe and comfortable, with you constantly there and at her beck and call. Change of any sort is hard for the elderly, one of the reasons I'm ambivilant about Mom making a major change at ninety. Yet, sometimes, it's beneficial, even if it's temporary. Given my mixed feelings, I can empathize with yours.
Red, I was glad to see someone else knew what a Ben Franklin was!
Hi DR
I am very familiar with a Ben Frankling sheet I just didn't know it was called that! I always thought it was a plus-minus sheet.
I am not sure mom will ever realize that she can be a bit difficult at times. Like we have talked about before they just want to know there are taken care of.
I actually do feel there is some health hazard for both mom and sis if they visit each other but no more of a health hazard then it has been for me all these years.
Bill
Hi DR
Now that you mentioned it, I've been picking up the pieces for years for family, etc.
I thought it was more that if I allowed mom to make the decision she wouldn't go to Utah, but after everyone's input she made her own decision and it was to go. There is even more to it, which I will talk about tomorrow.
I kind of thought that your mom let Deb make the decision for her and I really hope it works out!
Gosh based on our mom's comments it does sound like a lot of doubts!
Yes sis has been encouraging the trip for a long time and for some of the same reasons Deb encouraged you mom. Help with expenses, sis wouldn't have to travel here,
Bill
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