One of our blog family would like our input on a problem she was confronted with yesterday. I will chim in at the end of the day with my input as I don't want to influence anyone's opinion and what to her your unfettered advise for DR. Here is her email:
"I came out of Walmart and noticed an elderly man kind of wandering about the parking lot, somewhat oblivious to traffic. I put groceries in car, returned cart and he was still wandering, so I went over and asked if I could help, was he looking for his car. Yes, he was. Could he describe it. Yes, a medium sized red car. He said he could show me one like it, but not exactly, as it was an Intrepid and his was a Dodge (I know zilch about car makes and models). He agreed to stay by my car, while I searched the parking lot. A thorough tour revealed red vans, red trucks, no mid-sized red cars. I returned and he said the car he showed me was about where he thought he parked his car. I suggested we go into the store and ask them to help him, maybe call the cops and say his car had been taken. No dice, after long discussion. I went over and discovered "Dodge" on the side of the Intripid. I said I thought this was his car. No, he insisted. I suggested he try the key. It unlocked the door, but this was not his car. I suggested he try to start the car. It started, but this was not his car. I opened the glove compartment and found an expired insurance card. Asked him his name. It was his car. I pointed that out to him. No, he insisted, not his car. I showed him the card. He said whoever took his car left the card in this one and, besides, his name was misspelled. After another ten minutes or so, I finally got him to give me a phone number, to call his wife,.although he didn't know why I insisted on doing so, since she couldn't do anything. Called the number and a young man answered. I asked if he knew a Mr. Phillip Morris. Yes, he did. I explained I was with him and needed to talk to his wife. Am told his wife died four years ago and the young man would get his mother, Mr. Morris' daughter. She came on the line and I explained where I was, with her father. Her first question was whether he was all right. I said yes, but I was concerned about him wandering the parking lot and his insistence the car wasnt' his. She asked which Walmart I was at, confirmed the car was his and asked if I'd stay until she could get there. I agreed to wait. He continued to insist it was not his car. Daughter and grandson arrived about 15 minutes later and she was a bit sharp with him. She also made it clear my job was done and I should Go Away.
Here's my dilemna... Himself feels this should be reported to someone for a variety of reasons. One, should the man behind the wheel of a car. I know he has a driver's license, but don't know if it's valid or expired because I wasn't thinking clearly enough to ask to look it closely. I know he has an expired insurance card in the glove compartment, but don't know if he has a current one elsewhere. I know he has some form of dimentia or Alzheimers, given the issue of the car and the fact he told me to call his wife, who passed four years ago. Did his daughter know he'd left the house, given she didn't know where he was or which Walmart store? I know our neighbors in FL, whose wives had Alzheimers, often dealt with their "escapes." Fortunately, they were always on foot and there were near neighbors who stepped in and got them home. Mr. M was so focused on finding his car, he wasn't paying attention to other cars in the parking aisles, so was he in any danger? I felt the daughter and grandson treated this as if it wasn't uncommon and they knew how to take care of it and would I just go away. The only elder hotline I could find was United Way. The woman listened patiently, expressed concern, but said it wasn't their area and suggested I call the Upstate Alzheimer's Agency tomorrow and get their input.
I'm conflicted. I took responsibility for finding his car and finding family to help. Do I have a responsibility to report this to anyone and, if so, to whom? On what basis? His wellbeing? The wellbeing of others on the road? I am positively loath to take away independence, given what I've seen Mom go through, losing her ability to drive, her sight, her mobility. OTOH, at what point do you have to do that in some respects in everyone's best interest? I have no idea where to go from here and a strong suspicion the Alzheimer's Assoc isn't going to be real helpful. What would you do?
Bill, thanks. I'm really out of my depth here. I know his name and what street he lives on and what he drives, but nothing else. Was today an aberration or something that happens frequently? All things considered, why does he have keys to a car?
DanaRae, with no clue what to do"
What should she do? Call Elderly services? Call the police? Call the Division of Motor Vehicles? Nothing? Let's help out our blog sister here!
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6 comments:
Wow. Tough one. DR- you might check with your local police station. Talking to your doctor for advice is another idea. At the end of the day, since no one else witnessed the event, I doubt if anyone will do anything.
Big hug to you for being so kind.
Tough problem, indeed. DR, you were great - doing what you could. And you get a great big ATTAGIRL from me!
I think I'd call Elder Services and/or the Alzheimer's Association let one of them handle it.
I understand about losing independence, but this man has obviously gotten to the point where he should not be alone. We have dealt with this, with John's dad. He lived in another state, but he made the decision to come to live "with" us. We didn't actually tell him this, but there were two absolutes as far as we were concerned - he was not going to live under our roof, and he was not going to have a car.
We didn't put it to him in so many words, but kind of let it happen that way.
We quickly realized he had dementia and, in 20-20 hindsight, realized that it had been going on for some time. Over the four years remaining in his life - and as part of our lives, he progressed from independent living to assisted living to a nursing home (all in the same facility). So he was well and safely taken care of by family and by professionals.
Bill, thank you for posting my msg. To the rest of you, thanks for the report. I knew many here were dealing with/have dealt with Alzheimer and dementia. My grandmother had dementia. Where I was torn was between concern for the man and concern for his family's possible reaction to interference.
I did call the Alzheimer's Assoc this morning. The woman said she wasn't sure what they could do about the situation, as most times the family comes to them, unless they're in denial. She wasn't sure there were agencies that could investigate without information. I told her I had his name, the street listed on the insurance card and the phone number he gave me to call his home. She took all the information and said she was going to take the report to her director and see what they could do. Hopefully, they'll contact the family or an agency that can help. It may be they (family) need a better understanding of what's going on, the danger of him being out alone - as the AA lady said, he could have driven to Georgia or who knows where. They may be in denial or may just not know where to go for help. I just hope AA follows up and the man and family get some help. I may be wimping out, but was relieved to hand the situation over to someone else and not have to make decisions about contacting the police ore DMV or whomever.
I think you did great, DR! You may now remove this from your list of concerns. {s}
Hi DR
I think you did the right thing. Here are my thoughts:
Being short with a person with dementia is different than being angry with them. If it was anger than I would report the interaction between the daughter and the father because it could be a case of elder abuse. If she was just short that translates to fear. My dad had dementia and it was without a doubt the most difficult things I have ever dealt with. There were times when I was short with dad. But all those times is when dad did something that scared the hell out of me. Being short as a reaction to fear is normal for someone dealing with a relative with dementia. Being full bore anger is abuse.
With the relative out of the picture than there are things to ask yourself. Is he a danger to himself? (YES!). Is a danger to others. (YES! He could get into an accident and kill someone.). How would I feel if I heard that I did nothing and then read in the paper that a man was lost because he wandered off or someone was killed by a man driving that didn't know where he was? (terrible.) That means I would do something. First, I would have called the people you called. Second, I would have looked in the phone book under government offices and look in the county that you live in and search for the Department of (County, etc.) Aging and called them to tell them your experience and seek their input. Then the next time I was at the store I might even go into the store and tell the manager what happened and ask them and their employees be on the lookout for this man and make sure they watch out for him the next time he is in the store.
The one thing that that is absolutely true is your did more than 99% of the people in the world would do. You spent a lot of time making sure the man was safe. You get more than hugs from me! You get even more respect that I already had for you, which is a lot!
Thanks to Connie, Mary Z, and Pat for their input. You are very much appreciated.
Bill
Thanks, Bill. We really don't have an agency or council on aging that does anything (despite the listings in the phone book). I learned that with Mom. And the Alzheimer Assoc pretty much confirmed that this morning. Which is a really sad commentary. AT least they have a better shot at getting to someone who can help than I do, from what the lady said.
I think I so more resignation and impatience than anger, which is why I wasn't willing to classify the situation as a form of abuse. I think denial or not knowing what to do comes closer to the situation and hope AA will deal with that.
Like you, I thank the others. I think I needed reinforcement that what I did was right, in terms of contacting someone, but not getting directly involved with the family.
Y'all say "good job" on what I did, but I can't imagine anyone ignoring someone who was as confused and concerned as Mr M was. Everyone of us here would have done the same thing, try to help him find his car and locate his family.
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